New Pay-to-Play Fastpass System coming soon?
- Thread starter Tim
- Start date
PolynesianMedic
Global Moderator
If it is us coming back that they are trying to obtain, then take this pay-to-play system that route. Base it on how many times you have been there in the past. That way those of us that have been there, a lot, would benefit from a higher level of service then those that are first timers. Then again, that might alienate them and you don't want to do that. Maybe they should just leave it alone, or come up with a way to make everyone happy. 
Last edited by a moderator:
The casino comps system is a little different, but overall it's fairly valid. Casinos originally saw comps as a way to track high rollers and to assign them sufficient perks to retain their business, but what they quickly found was that many gamblers would gamble more (and beyond their means) in order to "earn" greater comps. There's a psychological effect at play where the gamblers get some kind of sense of self-worth from being perceived as a high roller, and thus would take more risks (ie gamble more) in order to be rated higher.
I'm not sure that will work at Disney. At it's core, gambling is a solitary pursuit and most high roller gamblers are loners. Disney is a purely family event, and adopting a pay-to-not-wait program will probably alienate those families, many of whom are stretching the budget to get to the park as is.
As far as the RFID and tracking, my objection is more to the fact that every facet of our existence within the park is being followed to maximize the amount of money they can take from us. As a corporate strategy, it's sound - but as an operating platform for a "family" company, it sucks. Disney better remember that they can't lose the humanity, and it's biggest enemy isn't Universal Studios but cynicism. Too many policies that anger people and they stop coming. If mom and dad stop coming, the kids don't get indoctrinated and then they don't come.
And for the record, as a litigator, I love RFID and member clubs and all those things that track your comings and goings. It's an excellent source of information for when I have to pry into an opponents personal life to figure out where they were and how much they have. Security tapes, key cards, all that stuff - it makes my job a lot easier: "Mr. Jones, you claim that in the days following the accident you were at home bedridden in severe pain, but your Member's Club at the local casino shows that you entered the casino at 2:31 pm and did not leave until 9:45 pm, gambling over $1250 on slot machines during that time. A review of security tapes showed you seated at a series of slots for over 7 hours, in no obvious pain and without needing any type of a break. How do you reconcile your testimony with what the evidence shows ?"
I'm not sure that will work at Disney. At it's core, gambling is a solitary pursuit and most high roller gamblers are loners. Disney is a purely family event, and adopting a pay-to-not-wait program will probably alienate those families, many of whom are stretching the budget to get to the park as is.
As far as the RFID and tracking, my objection is more to the fact that every facet of our existence within the park is being followed to maximize the amount of money they can take from us. As a corporate strategy, it's sound - but as an operating platform for a "family" company, it sucks. Disney better remember that they can't lose the humanity, and it's biggest enemy isn't Universal Studios but cynicism. Too many policies that anger people and they stop coming. If mom and dad stop coming, the kids don't get indoctrinated and then they don't come.
And for the record, as a litigator, I love RFID and member clubs and all those things that track your comings and goings. It's an excellent source of information for when I have to pry into an opponents personal life to figure out where they were and how much they have. Security tapes, key cards, all that stuff - it makes my job a lot easier: "Mr. Jones, you claim that in the days following the accident you were at home bedridden in severe pain, but your Member's Club at the local casino shows that you entered the casino at 2:31 pm and did not leave until 9:45 pm, gambling over $1250 on slot machines during that time. A review of security tapes showed you seated at a series of slots for over 7 hours, in no obvious pain and without needing any type of a break. How do you reconcile your testimony with what the evidence shows ?"
Last edited by a moderator:
This is getting off the topic, but I'm with you on RFIDs. I just got a passport for the cruise portion of Mousefest.. and I'm only too well aware that that thing includes an RFID. This is a controversial topic, everyone's always trying to use security concerns to justify it but RFIDs are NOT secure, I insist that the only reason the government is sneaking them into passports is that they have a desire to track people's movements without their being aware. Otherwise it's no more secure than sticking some sort of barcode on the passport. It's just a barcode that they can read through your clothing from ten feet (or more) away without you having any idea of it.
I'm working on making some sort of metallic shield I can keep the passport in when I'm walking through the airport. I'm only too aware of how easy it is for someone with a portable code reader to lift my code by walking past me.. by the same token I'd never get one of those credit cards with built in RFIDs, that's like a built in identify theft feature.
As for tracking in Disney.. eh.. I admit I didn't read the original story. As I made it abundantly clear, I'm VERY opposed to the whole pay to play fastpass concept and I have no desire to read further details about it. So I missed the tracking thing. I'm not asking anyone to explain it, it's not important.. but I guess I'd at least agree with the idea that Disney can't lose the humanity. I know how strongly Disney tries to monitor and regulate everything, I know that even the darkest parts of their dark rides have IR cameras that can see everything quite clearly, every time I pass through a set of turnstiles or break an IR beam I imagine a number in some computer somewhere incrementing by one to include me in some statistic. I like to think that they're trying to keep everything running smoothly, and if tracking people more closely is able to clearly benefit them in the logistics department, not just in the money grubbing department, I can deal with it.
Don't get me wrong, I'm rabidly aware of the current privacy crisis and generally violently resist any attempt to take what privacy I have left away from me. But despite everything negative I've just said I still think positively of Disney World, I think of it as a huge, intricate machine that must require some significant oversight. If they're able to gather some new information and run things better (and passing the gains on to the guests, not just the shareholders) then go to it. With their history of exploiting cutting edge technology it seems kind of appropriate.
I have no idea how they could use personal tracking to try to squeeze more money out of me. I mean there are various levels.. if I ride Living with the Land an unusual (compared to other people) number of times and they somehow send a message to me suggesting I try out the Behind the Seeds greenhouse tour, is that stepping over the line? The truth is I enjoyed the tour, I wish I hadn't waited so long to take it. I dislike any sort of suggestive selling, but this is perhaps the least intrusive way I could imagine it being done.
I just don't know how much further they could go. I mean what.. telemarketing calls on your room phone from Mickey Mouse pushing reservations at expensive restaurants? Instead of a mini-bar they could have a mini gift shop in the rooms.. I'm kidding, but I don't see what more they can do.
Then again I guess this is an area I'd rather not see them pushing the limits.
I'm working on making some sort of metallic shield I can keep the passport in when I'm walking through the airport. I'm only too aware of how easy it is for someone with a portable code reader to lift my code by walking past me.. by the same token I'd never get one of those credit cards with built in RFIDs, that's like a built in identify theft feature.
As for tracking in Disney.. eh.. I admit I didn't read the original story. As I made it abundantly clear, I'm VERY opposed to the whole pay to play fastpass concept and I have no desire to read further details about it. So I missed the tracking thing. I'm not asking anyone to explain it, it's not important.. but I guess I'd at least agree with the idea that Disney can't lose the humanity. I know how strongly Disney tries to monitor and regulate everything, I know that even the darkest parts of their dark rides have IR cameras that can see everything quite clearly, every time I pass through a set of turnstiles or break an IR beam I imagine a number in some computer somewhere incrementing by one to include me in some statistic. I like to think that they're trying to keep everything running smoothly, and if tracking people more closely is able to clearly benefit them in the logistics department, not just in the money grubbing department, I can deal with it.
Don't get me wrong, I'm rabidly aware of the current privacy crisis and generally violently resist any attempt to take what privacy I have left away from me. But despite everything negative I've just said I still think positively of Disney World, I think of it as a huge, intricate machine that must require some significant oversight. If they're able to gather some new information and run things better (and passing the gains on to the guests, not just the shareholders) then go to it. With their history of exploiting cutting edge technology it seems kind of appropriate.
I have no idea how they could use personal tracking to try to squeeze more money out of me. I mean there are various levels.. if I ride Living with the Land an unusual (compared to other people) number of times and they somehow send a message to me suggesting I try out the Behind the Seeds greenhouse tour, is that stepping over the line? The truth is I enjoyed the tour, I wish I hadn't waited so long to take it. I dislike any sort of suggestive selling, but this is perhaps the least intrusive way I could imagine it being done.
I just don't know how much further they could go. I mean what.. telemarketing calls on your room phone from Mickey Mouse pushing reservations at expensive restaurants? Instead of a mini-bar they could have a mini gift shop in the rooms.. I'm kidding, but I don't see what more they can do.
Then again I guess this is an area I'd rather not see them pushing the limits.
Last edited by a moderator:
Dan,
I think I heard on one of Leo Laporte's tech podcasts that there are already passport shields on the market to block the RFID's from being read
I think I heard on one of Leo Laporte's tech podcasts that there are already passport shields on the market to block the RFID's from being read
Dan -
The black helicopter people are all over it.
Here's a RFID blocking wallet you can buy: http://www.wired.com/gadgets/miscellane ... eel_wallet
Here's how to make one: http://www.rpi-polymath.com/ducttape/RFIDWallet.php
There's tons of info to be found on Google on this.
The black helicopter people are all over it.
Here's a RFID blocking wallet you can buy: http://www.wired.com/gadgets/miscellane ... eel_wallet
Here's how to make one: http://www.rpi-polymath.com/ducttape/RFIDWallet.php
There's tons of info to be found on Google on this.
Last edited by a moderator:
PolynesianMedic
Global Moderator
It's amazing to me that people really care about who knows your whereabouts. I personally don't care because it is a passive system, and doesn't affect me. I think that in the days ahead we are going to see more of this as technology grows and shrinks and allows for more information to be readily available. As long as the information isn't being used maliciously, I really don't mind someone gathering it. I think that there should be fail safes in place to protect the info from those out there that would use it maliciously, but that's it. Sorry, this is just my thoughts.
Last edited by a moderator:
The only information I care about getting "out there" is any info that can be used to acquire credit in my name (i.e. identity theft). Other than that, I don't care.
Last edited by a moderator:
PolynesianMedic
Global Moderator
"harra" said:
Exactly.
Last edited by a moderator:
"PolynesianMedic" said:
And therein lies the rub. What kind of fail safes ? Who controls them ? Who has access to the information ? It's easy to just abdicate privacy rights and individual freedoms and just "hope" that some benevoent uber-power will behave responsibly, but thousands of years of human evolution have pretty much showed that you can't trust big business (or governments, or any number of other groups) to act in anything resembling your best interests. That isn't their purpose.
I've probably spent too much time drinking beers with my Libertarian friends, or reading pro bono briefs from the Electronic Freedom Foundation, but issues (and technologies) like RFID scare me just BECAUSE they are always abused, and always have unitended consequences. There's probably no way to avoid sacrificing a degree of privacy to the alter of convenience in the electronic age, but it sure as heck is something to be concerned about.
Maybe I'm just paranoid. After all, those scenes in Minority Report with shoppers having to endure a barrage of "personalized" advertisements as they walked through the mall scared me.
Last edited by a moderator:
haunteddoc
Member
OK, I'm ignorant. (No comments please.) What is RFID?
Last edited by a moderator:
haunteddoc
Member
OK, so why is this so bad and where is it used?
Last edited by a moderator:
The horror stories passed around by the privacy advocates back when Wal-Mart was planning on using them for product control was that stores would eventually embed these devices in everything so that when you walk in a store they could tell what you are wearing, where you bought. The fact that you are carrying a soda that you didn't buy there.
Then another store tracks the same data and eventually a gov't agency could subpoena that data and they could get a down-to-the-minute track of where you've been.
There are a lot of good uses for them
For example, the Spectromagic parade uses them to keep the floats on track
Technologists say that once grocery items are embedded with them, you could create a smart refridgerator that could tell you everything that's in your fridge and could be programmed to print out grocery lists based on knowing what is missing as well.
RFID chips are what are emedded in your pets if you have them "chipped". There are rumors that rich people overseas embed their kids with them for tracking purposes and there is also talk about embedding one in yourself and all your data would be stored on it so you wouldn't have to carry a wallet
Then another store tracks the same data and eventually a gov't agency could subpoena that data and they could get a down-to-the-minute track of where you've been.
There are a lot of good uses for them
For example, the Spectromagic parade uses them to keep the floats on track
Technologists say that once grocery items are embedded with them, you could create a smart refridgerator that could tell you everything that's in your fridge and could be programmed to print out grocery lists based on knowing what is missing as well.
RFID chips are what are emedded in your pets if you have them "chipped". There are rumors that rich people overseas embed their kids with them for tracking purposes and there is also talk about embedding one in yourself and all your data would be stored on it so you wouldn't have to carry a wallet
Last edited by a moderator:
"Craig" said:
I've heard that too.
That's why I hate when privacy advocates stop such great progress
Don't forget the new Nikon D300 and D3 which communicate to secret government Wi-Fi locations and notify the authorities that you are taking pictures of certain locations throughout the country. Kind of like the digital footprint imbedded in every color laser printer. ;D
Last edited by a moderator:
That would be my Verizon network"Craig" said: