Bloomberg: Canon/Nikon = snail mail, Sony = email

There are a few very big IFs in that article though, and one particular hang-up. ; First, it's about the big share change in the Japanese market - which is extremely different from the US market. ; They are prone to embrace miniaturization, technology, and fancy design more than the U.S. or European markets. ; Second, all that has to happen for the entire situation to change is for Nikon or Canon to release a mirrorless model - after which it will become the greatest thing since sliced bread and outsell all others based on absolutely no other factor than the name on the front. ; They have the name recognition - and not really for the true enthusiast groups, but for the masses. ; Enthusiasts tend to do more research, and some of them find their way to Sony, Pentax, Panasonic, or Olympus after determining that the feature set or design was better suited to them than what Canon or Nikon offered. ; The pro market has to stick with what they already have, because they've invested tens of thousands into lenses and bodies, and because they get a special tailored service from the well established pro divisions of those two makers. ; The total amateur market buys based on brand name familiarity and presumed superiority...all they have to hear is that pros use Canon or Nikon, and that's what they want. ; And with the advertising push and market cornering those two can achieve with their profit margins from the pro cameras, they can make sure even their cheapo stuff sells on brand-cache alone.

So, Canon or Nikon make a mirrorless model, and advantage: gone for Sony and Panasonic. ; Fortunately, if Sony or Panasonic can drop the silly pursuit of #1 status and stop trying to knock off the other two big makers, and instead concentrate on making solid products with unique advantages at a profit, and be happy with #3 or #4...they can thrive as a company and we enthusiasts can enjoy the excellent and diverse selection in the marketplace.
 
Well said, Justin. ; I would love canon's 1dMk5 to be mirrorless. ; That would be fantastic.

sent from my htc thunderbolt ;
 
"zackiedawg" said:
So, Canon or Nikon make a mirrorless model, and advantage: gone for Sony and Panasonic. ;
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With that being said, Nikon supposedly has a mirrorless model in production. ; However, they are going to use a sensor smaller than m4/3, which is defeating the purpose of mirrorless: ; to use smaller lenses yet still allow the larger 35mm lenses during a transition time.

Haven't heard from Canon, which is why I think this article was written. ; In fact actually Canon has publicly stated "Our customers are not requesting a mirrorless camera."

Read that quote and tell me what is wrong with it.....
 
Canon is definitely stubborn. ; Unfortunately their #1 position allows them to be lazy and react late - they'll wait around if and until mirrorless has fully matured and is a viable replacement for DSLRs, and taking big chunks of the market...then amble in and be competitive sales-wise in mere weeks.

I agree Nikon's first move isn't quite the equivalent - I personally don't understand it very much, other than as a replacement for the old prosumer P&S market that is barely alive. ; It definitely isn't competing at the same level as M4:3 or NEX. ; Pentax is going that route too for now, though with an even smaller P&S sensor...supposedly something more akin to the Nikon will follow. ; I can't imagine M4:3 or NEX being real worried about Nikon's first move...it depends on what they decide to do next. ; If indeed Canon doesn't enter the market, and Nikon stays with the little sensor, both M4:3 and NEX will make some large gains and profits for a while.
 
mirrorless is the future of photography, i'm more convinced now than ever of that, i went to citifield last week to watch my beloved mutts actually beat the marlins. each stadium has it's own rules as to that you can bring, none of them realistic or knowledgeable, the mets simply state, " no professional cameras ", one team has an 8" size limit on lenses? not clear if they mean without body or not.
the point of this ramble is i got acceptable photos using ; my panasonic lumix g1 body, with the 45-200 lens, which in 35mm terms is 90-400. i do not have the 100-300 yet, and the newest body, the g3, is not available yet in the us. probably due to the earthquake recovery in progress still in japan
michael reichman of the luminescent landscape has a preproduction model reviewed, given how close to the earthuake he recieved it, it's probably the final hardware version, maybe just software tweaks at release, that he thinks very highly of, so based on all this, you can believe that i will be ordering this updated body as soon as it's in stock at b&h
i believe canon and nikon will both be forced into this move, that canon will be forced to maintain the current eos mount, so i see a day somewhere in my future where i will be using my beloved L lenses on a much lighter and smaller body
 
All of this makes my head spin and throws a wrench into my next camera purchase.....maybe my canon 40D will last forever!
 
"zackiedawg" said:
The pro market has to stick with what they already have, because they've invested tens of thousands into lenses and bodies, and because they get a special tailored service from the well established pro divisions of those two makers. ;
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Don't get me wrong, I think mirrored cameras will be here until the speed of on-sensor phase detection AF matches the current technology.

But like snail mail, it will only be used for select reasons.....
 
Canon and Nikon are not the most innovative companies in the world. Japan is not learning from the USA's mistakes. SONY is shaking up the industry and if the two big boys don't start wising up, they are going to be looking up one day and wonder what happened. ;

Really, we should have things like swappable sensors for when you need full frame goodness and high ISO capablilty or cropped for sports and wildlife and a sensor for video. ; Mirrorless for speed and less movement. ; Better software like in camera light range processing (a la SONY's HDR), geo tagging and Wi-Fi in a body with lenses we don't have to throw away for upgrading to it.

I do not think I am asking a lot here. ; None of these technologies are ground breaking in this day.
 
Indeed Scott - it's probably coming, or something close to it. ; Other than the swappable sensors, the A77 already checks almost every box there - though rather than 'no' mirror, it uses a fixed one, which still avoids any movement or vibration and allows for the superfast tracking burst mode. ; Rumors seem to point to an 'A99' full frame sensor Sony coming using the same tech and style, and it would likely have a crop mode for 1.5x crop frame lenses and such - with the huge resolution likely to be used (35-40MP), the crop on the sensor would still be yielding the resolution of APS-C sensors of today.

I'm still not aboard the SLT mirror train, as the EVFs haven't yet as of this moment in time evolved to be as good for my style of wildlife and bird shooting when panning/tracking - though the A77 might have solved that issue (looks good in early tests, but I'd need to try one myself to really find out)...and I don't like the power drain the EVF cameras suffer making battery life quite poor compared to modern DSLRs (I can shoot 3,500 shots on a battery with my camera, which is rated for 1,000 CIPA - the A77 it hit with a 400 CIPA rating). ; But they're certainly innovating.

And when you use a mirrorless body like my NEX with a classic old lens, it's easy to fall in love - waist-level stance, LCD tilted up, classic aperture ring and manual focus ring on the lens, shutter adjusted via the camera's jog wheel, manual focus peaking lighting up the focus area...it's like old fashioned classic photography with a modern twist, and very different from DSLR shooting.
 
There are some great comments and thoughts, here. ; For now, I will just continue working towards my 60D purchase, and leave the cutting edge stuff to those with even bigger wallets. ;)
 
"Scottwdw" said:
Really, we should have things like swappable sensors for when you need full frame goodness and high ISO capablilty or cropped for sports and wildlife and a sensor for video. ; Mirrorless for speed and less movement. ; Better software like in camera light range processing (a la SONY's HDR), geo tagging and Wi-Fi in a body with lenses we don't have to throw away for upgrading to it.
Click to expand...

FWIW, Ricoh is doing this now. ; Before you got the sensor AND lens in one module, but now they have released a sensor + Leica mount module. ; So you can change the lenses. ; I wonder if what would happen if Sony and Ricoh were to combine forces...... ; hmmmm


On a side note, it appears that Nikon's imminent mirrorless announcement is getting a lackluster response, probably because who wants to use 35mm lenses on a sensor smaller than m4/3?
 
"PolynesianMedic" said:
There are some great comments and thoughts, here. ; For now, I will just continue working towards my 60D purchase, and leave the cutting edge stuff to those with even bigger wallets. ;)
Click to expand...

Great idea, taking the same approach here!
 
Interesting, and thanks for linking it...it was interesting to see that they're starting to worry and think about it. ; Probably knowing that Nikon was going forth made Canon see the need to have something, and they're trying to decide if the Pentax/Nikon approach of something more like a P&S camera but with changeable lenses, or the M4:3 approach of a larger sensor but still smaller than DSLR, or the Sony/Samsung approach of full APS-C sensor in smaller body, is the best way to go.

I went ahead and helped them out by taking the survey too - I figured since I do own a Canon SLR, and previously had a compact, I could be considered a helpful owner - and especially as I could help them with responses about why and how I selected a mirrorless camera (because I answered that I owned one, it gave me a dropdown of current models to select mine from, then had 2 or 3 pages of questions about what features I wanted when I chose it, and what features I was satisfied/dissatisfied with on it).

Competition is healthy, and choice and variety good for all, so if I can help Canon put out something competitive and good, more's the better for us all (too late to save Nikon, who's going the small-sensor route). ; ;)
 
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